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Post by Father on Dec 24, 2019 14:34:46 GMT 1
What Roland and Daeron asks might have been possible under a different set of circumstances, but the choices made at Highgarden have sealed the positions, Bittersteel notes sourly. Roland may be the rare soul driven by personal morals rather than one's own partisan gain, though it is difficult to remain impartial when pursuing one's own claim. Which is what holds Ser Daemon back, or so Aegor claims though he does sound a bit like a man trying to convince himself of this fact. It matters not, duels, tourneys and other games that knights of summer likes to play are always viewed as signs and portends in favor of those supporting the cause espoused by the victors and ignored as mere chance by everyone else, or should the events at Summerhall exonerate Ser Rennifer?
Lord Quentin, Bittersteel notes, though it surely is not lost on him that it really is Maegelle with Normyn as her agent that truly is in control of Hammerhaal, has shown loyalty to he who should be king. Roland has sided with those who would deny Ser Daemon his rightful place upon the Iron Throne, no lord that Bittersteel could possibly sway would be inclined to back Roland's claim, and all those who might do so are counted among the many enemies of the realm, Bittersteel remembers his knightly vows to defend the throne from such enemies. Words matters, and where the loyalists would call him rebel, Bittersteel meticulously frames himself and those joined in his cause as righteous defenders.
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Post by Roland Cordwayner on Dec 24, 2019 17:23:56 GMT 1
"What use has your side for loyalty from those that bring you scant strength and such scandal?"
"I would not ask nor expect you to back my claim. But hold your friends and allies back from this conflict, near lost as it is already. Indeed, many of them are friends of mine too. Recent legal decisions, duels and the popular opinion of every lordly court from the Red Mountains to the Neck is against my sister by marriage."
"House Cordwayner will not tip any balance and having it alongside Ser Daemon Blackfyre in any civil strife would besmirch your cause rather than bolster it."
"Whoever rules, better a strong House Cordwayner to raise future Kingsguards and keep the realm safe from its many enemies than the hollow mockery my relatives have made of it. The less blood shed here, the more local the coflict is kept, the better for the realm we both seek to protect."
The conversation was a sorrow to Roland, reminding him of how many among Blackfyre's supporters were dear to him. In another life he may even have stood among them, suited as he was to the cause in temperament and ability.
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Post by Daeron Wildfyre on Dec 24, 2019 20:16:46 GMT 1
Daeron frowned and opened his mouth, as if to speak, before closing it again.
Aegor will never support Roland without him publicly denouncing the king and embracing Blackfyre. To do anything else would simply make him look weak and the cause appear to be one that abandons it’s staunchest supporters for their enemies. Little better than the weakling on the Iron Throne.
Perhaps he had something to say, but it would have to wait until the next exchange between them.
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Post by Father on Dec 25, 2019 16:28:12 GMT 1
Where a more tactful man might have shown sympathy to Roland's arguments and politely explained the reality of things, Bittersteel only manages to avoid being rude. In short, though he does not say so explicitly. As an individual, Ser Normyn is considered Roland's equal in value as a supporter of a cause, and when all those supporting Roland's claims are also supporting the Queen's son, it is not a matter in which the supporters of he who should be king can show weakness. Lords and ladies decide what to believe of Lord Quentyn across partisan lines, and truth is the first to fall in the battle of public opinion. That this seems to be a very strong parallel to his own fight regarding Ser Daemon's claim, a man might find to be an amusing irony. But not Ser Aegor Rivers.
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Post by Roland Cordwayner on Dec 27, 2019 13:24:34 GMT 1
"Then let us settle the matter as equals, for in doing so you stand to prosper whichever of us triumphs, as will House Cordwayner. And when House Cordwayner is stronger the realm is stronger."
"If my bastard brother and sister by marriage prevail, you shall enjoy whatever strength a scandal struck Hammerhal can bring, deprived as it is of any knight that would speak against them."
"But when I restore Hammerhal to the Seven's light, men shall know you and your allies live the principles you espouse, even when it would be easier to abandon the honourable path. In doing so you gain more in reputation and doubtless attendant swords than either my bastard brother or I can call at Hammerhal."
"Better yet, you will have given up little in doing so, such are the political circumstances arrayed against Hammerhal's current rulers. Further, my own voice shall ring out to note the principled stand, that Ser Daemon Blackfyre's friends share his virtues. My fellow knights named me captain at Highgarden and my voice would carry further from a higher seat."
[OOC: -"Rally members of the faction to work against the interests of an NPC of the opposing faction (Status <=3+1 per additional 1 points spent. Or Status <=5+1 per additional point spent if you personally partake in the scheming with heightened risk of being found out)"
- Roland will spend his one Fire point and personally take part in scheming against the Cordwayners with Ser Aegor Rivers, facilitated by Ser Daeron Wildfyre. - Appreciate this may just bring him to Neutral on the Cordwayners rather than fully antagonistic.]
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Post by Father on Dec 28, 2019 1:49:51 GMT 1
If the evidence for what Roland claims to be true is compelling enough, then surely Lord Tyrell would call for a proper review and see to it that justice is done? Bittersteel seems not to have any particular interest in getting himself involved one way or the other. But surely he must know that it is whispered that The Longthorn avoids any and all hard decisions that he might tuck out of sight in some secluded corner of his briar maze, out of sight, out of mind. An astute observer might get the impression that he considers the matter too trivial to care about, a skilled schemer would suspect that he leaves such considerations to Lord Peake. A cynical observer of the game of thrones might suggest that the Blackfyre supporters in The Reach have invested too much in Lord Quentin to be able to back down from this fight, and to speak against such lords and knights as will oppose Roland's claim is a battle that is not worth fighting even if he would have wanted the outcome sought.
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Post by Roland Cordwayner on Dec 31, 2019 12:45:29 GMT 1
[OOC: based on revised Blood/Fire rules Roland will offer his Fire point to Aegor, provided it is not spent on some dishonourable cause. In exchange, he expects the Cordwayner conflict to be resolved as a family matter rather than escalated.]
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Post by Father on Jan 1, 2020 9:18:52 GMT 1
It already has escalated and Bittersteel probably couldn't stop it even if he wanted to.
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Post by Roland Cordwayner on Apr 7, 2020 9:22:07 GMT 1
[OOC: do we have a sane compromise solution here? Roland passed up on a Blood point from snubbing this event to attend and gain a Fire point, which at the time would have allowed him to get a favour from Bittersteel. The rules having been changed midstream is frustrating so I hope we can find a sensible way to spend the point and reflect the original intent, particularly as some broader Fire/Blood stuff weighs in the the Cordwayner plot and it doubles the frustration that this point can't do what it previously would have been able to achieve and now counts against Roland's cause. Double so including the foregone Blood point. Thanks for any help threading the needle here!]
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Post by Father on Apr 7, 2020 22:53:44 GMT 1
From my perspective this was playing out as Daeron the PC coming up with an idea that turned out not to be as good as hoped, I don't remember (and can't find) any communication on how this was envisioned to end, other than Marq strongly doubting something like this was possible.
The rules being changed midstream, to my memory, did not substantially change what was possible to achieve. Mostly changing the mechanic from spend fire point-> gain a favor, to spend fire point on something the NPC would like as a favor to the NPC -> gain a favor. To make Bittersteel go against Maegelle&co wasn't really achievable, largely because he defers to Gormon and others on faction politics in the reach, and largely because he's a realist that knows that their faction has thrown in with Maegelle for good or ill. The people on the Blackfyre faction that might see things Roland's way are the same people that Balon dislikes for putting things like truth, honor and gallantry ahead of politics. Bittersteel is not one of those.
The uses for fire points towards this end probably will be somewhat more indirect, either for a +1 disposition with faction members or for +3 to influence tests in a single intrigue to win someone over. There's some a complex intrigue (which as per current draft will overrule the words are wind stipulations) setup simmering on the stove in the backrooms that should offer guidance as to how to make things happen, although that relies on me ending up with something I like, presently prioritizing the one for Leo Tyrell's leanings.
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Post by Roland Cordwayner on Apr 8, 2020 9:32:10 GMT 1
From my perspective this was playing out as Daeron the PC coming up with an idea that turned out not to be as good as hoped, I don't remember (and can't find) any communication on how this was envisioned to end, other than Marq strongly doubting something like this was possible. The rules being changed midstream, to my memory, did not substantially change what was possible to achieve. Mostly changing the mechanic from spend fire point-> gain a favor, to spend fire point on something the NPC would like as a favor to the NPC -> gain a favor. To make Bittersteel go against Maegelle&co wasn't really achievable, largely because he defers to Gormon and others on faction politics in the reach, and largely because he's a realist that knows that their faction has thrown in with Maegelle for good or ill. The people on the Blackfyre faction that might see things Roland's way are the same people that Balon dislikes for putting things like truth, honor and gallantry ahead of politics. Bittersteel is not one of those. The uses for fire points towards this end probably will be somewhat more indirect, either for a +1 disposition with faction members or for +3 to influence tests in a single intrigue to win someone over. There's some a complex intrigue (which as per current draft will overrule the words are wind stipulations) setup simmering on the stove in the backrooms that should offer guidance as to how to make things happen, although that relies on me ending up with something I like, presently prioritizing the one for Leo Tyrell's leanings. OOC: There was a material change from the old: ""Rally members of the faction to work against the interests of an NPC of the opposing faction (Status <=3+1 per additional 1 points spent. Or Status <=5+1 per additional point spent if you personally partake in the scheming with heightened risk of being found out)." It does substantially change what was possible to achieve.
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Post by Father on Apr 8, 2020 11:57:44 GMT 1
That line is still in there, but it's against the opposing faction.
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